Re: Bergara barrels
About the worse barrel you could buy. CVA muzzle loaders. Same company.
Re: Bergara barrels
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: tomme boy</div><div class="ubbcode-body">About the worse barrel you could buy. CVA muzzle loaders. Same company. </div></div>
On the contrary Tom, the barrels are quite good. Its funny how you will see a company that had a recall 15 years ago and say they are still bad.
Ruger had more than one on their LCP and smith has had their fair share over the years as well.
You should check this out.
http://blog.cva.com/the-truth-about-cva-muzzleloaders/
You really need to read that.
Re: Bergara barrels
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: mikki</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Anyone know anything about these. Accuracy etc, how do they measure up to the big hitters. </div></div>
The barrels are awesome. I have two and looking to do a 3rd with them.
My model 70 in 308 will hold 1/4 MOA at 150 with factory 165 gr BTHP match. No trigger adjustment and glass bedded in wood stock. I also have a 10/22 with a bergara that will shoot the same hole all day at 75 yards.
My next build will be a 6.5x47 Lapua. I'll let ya know how that goes.
If you want more info, please give me a call at 404-769-1112.
Thanks,
Eric
Note: My shot was on good conditions and a nice clear day.
Re: Bergara barrels
With the talk of scopes like Nightforce (japan) and S&B (Germany), being first picks, I'm surprised to hear that. I hope you shoot a remington factory in mcmillan stock with a leupold on top and badger rings. You cannot use the M5 bottom metal though due to the AI mags made in England. What sling would you put on it, the swivels will surely be made out of the US.
Not arguing, just making a point. High quality products can be found in the US and in many other countries.
Just my .02
Re: Bergara barrels
In hind sight, I shouldn't have mentioned it being foreign.
My intent wasn't to throw it under the bus because it is foreign. Point I was trying to make that they are somewhat comparaable in price to the 'heavy hitters' as the OP put it, and why not spend the extra $$$ and get something that has been proven.
My apologies if I offended anyone.
Re: Bergara barrels
TB, your post has little basis. I think from looking at the two websites that CVA has done a great deal to improve what they offer. I do not think Ed Shilen would lend his name to junk.
I have a buddy that put one of the Bergara Remington Nut barrels on his rifle and it shoots 1/2 MOA out to 600 with Fac/Fed 168 Match.
Re: Bergara barrels
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: EricM40</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Apology accepted.
</div></div>
do you work for Bergara???? Because it sure sounds like you do. I would rather pony up the extra cash and buy from a PROVEN barrel maker such as Rock Creek, Krieger, Bartlein, Broughton, Brux, Shilen, LW, Schneider. So yeah id rather buy an American barrel than go foreign and have a middle of the road quality barrel.
Re: Bergara barrels
Look in the GB section. Sure looks like he does.
They may have improved quality, but I still would buy a Shaw over CVA.
I have just seen too many CVA's over the years and they were all sub par.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: EricM40</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> High quality products can be found in the US and in many other countries.
Just my .02 </div></div>
And like you said, you can find quality and junk here and over seas.
- May 14, 2004
- 1,150
- 4
- 68
Re: Bergara barrels
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: EricM40</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
will hold 1/4 MOA
that will shoot the same hole all day
Eric </div></div>
Always my 2 favorite internet statements!!!! Either I have really really really bad luck or really really suck at shooting because I have never owned a factory or custom barreled rifle that was capable of doing either or both 100% of the time. Now, to make these statements without it being consistently possible 100% of the time one should then use the words "on occassion" or even "rarely" to make such claims
Re: Bergara barrels
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: SDWhirlwind</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: EricM40</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
will hold 1/4 MOA
that will shoot the same hole all day
Eric </div></div>
Always my 2 favorite internet statements!!!! Either I have really really really bad luck or really really suck at shooting because I have never owned a factory or custom barreled rifle that was capable of doing either or both 100% of the time. Now, to make these statements without it being consistently possible 100% of the time one should then use the words "on occassion" or even "rarely" to make such claims
</div></div>
Then you my friend have never owned a APA built rifle, my 7WSM will hold 1/4moa or better all day every day, but the question is, will the nut behind the trigger.......
Re: Bergara barrels
The way I see it, you can send your hard earned $$ to any country you wish but preferring to spend it on high quality US made products is nothing to apologize for, my rig? RTM chassis, Pierce TG action, Hart barrel, USO SN3, Jewell trigger.
- May 14, 2004
- 1,150
- 4
- 68
Re: Bergara barrels
Oh, I don't doubt there are numerous full custom rigs that will maintain near 1/4 moa with reasonable regularity. However there are damn few and I mean damn few shooters who can 100% of the time for any length of time maintain 1/4 moa. I have little problem with throwing the BS flag with 99.5% of the shooters on this forum or most others who claim capable of it. Now on Benchrest Central forums in full blown BR rigs off a 1000# bench with wind flags, front and rear bags etc and damn sure not tactical rigs there would be a higher percentage then with any other type of shooter. They will try 6-12 barrels until they get one they think is a winner and there aren't many calibers any of them would use, a 308 isn't one of them.
Just remember that the psychotic BR boys rarely have a perfect day with everything under 1/4 moa @ 100yds. Then to come on this forum and claim your after market lesser name barrel will "maintain 1/4 moa @ 150 yds with factory ammo", not 100 yrds but 150 yds and with factory ammo and not the anal loads a BR boy pumps down range is about as credible as me selling maps to the location Jimmy Hoffa resides at currently.
Suppose like anything else my choice of words and topic will cause name calling, PM threats of ass kicking etc but I just don't see it nor do I ever see making a claim you cannot back up or verify. However, that is just my miserable, grumpy old bastard, everybody hates me opinion
Respectfully,
Dennis
Re: Bergara barrels
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: SDWhirlwind</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: EricM40</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
will hold 1/4 MOA
that will shoot the same hole all day
Eric </div></div>
Always my 2 favorite internet statements!!!! Either I have really really really bad luck or really really suck at shooting because I have never owned a factory or custom barreled rifle that was capable of doing either or both 100% of the time. Now, to make these statements without it being consistently possible 100% of the time one should then use the words "on occassion" or even "rarely" to make such claims
</div></div>
Ok, Ok, Ok, on a nice sunny day (I shot it at 75 degrees last spring) with good quality match grade ammo (168gr BTHP) I can and will consistently hold 1/4" MOA at 150. Should have noted that earlier. I will make a point of it. I will say that the rifle shoots tighter at 150 than at 100.
Yes, I do work for Bergara Barrels and have Lowlight's approval for the post in the GB section. I never intended on being here as a company employee, but rather as an individual. I am very proud of what our barrels can do and would like to share it with the rest of you.
Re: Bergara barrels
Eric, im not doubting your intentions or motives with your ties to Bergara, but to claim you can and will consistently hold 1/4 MOA @ 150 is completely and udderly f*cking stupid. If you can, i would ask you to go to the match that is right around Atlanta and shoot it. I will pay your match fee, but if you dont hold 1/4 MOA consistently you repay me your match fee. There are very few consistent 1/4 MOA shooters that are able to do it over a broad spectrum of weather. Sure i can go sit on a square range when its nice out and shoot 10 5shot groups and end up with 1/4 MOA, does that make me a "Consistent" 1/4 MOA shooter? Nope, that means i had a good day.
Re: Bergara barrels
Dead,
I shot on a nice day, not rainy, not snowy, but a nice day with clear weather. I used match grade ammo. I did not shoot 10 groups, and pick the best one.
Matches are a totally different ball game, I've never shot one. Not officially anyways. I cannot say how I would preform at a match regardless of rifle. I would try it though.
Re: Bergara barrels
Not wishing to join the fray, but having actually done some checking of the Bergara web site, I am pleasantly surprised to see a barrel manufacturer who has embraced the major advantage of the Savage 110 rifle design and made it available for other marques.
I cannot make any comments about accuracy from my own vantage, but I note that prices are good to fair, depending on chambering. I further note that while popular chamberings are available, I'd be pleased to see additional offerings for 6BR/BRX, .260 Rem, and .280 Rem.
Greg
Re: Bergara barrels
quote,
" No trigger adjustment and glass bedded in wood stock"
this would seem to further complicate the effort.
JH
Re: Bergara barrels
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Greg Langelius *</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Not wishing to join the fray, but having actually done some checking of the Bergara web site, I am pleasantly surprised to see a barrel manufacturer who has embraced the major advantage of the Savage 110 rifle design and made it available for other marques.
I cannot make any comments about accuracy from my own vantage, but I note that prices are good to fair, depending on chambering. I further note that while popular chamberings are available, I'd be pleased to see additional offerings for 6BR/BRX, .260 Rem, and .280 Rem.
Greg </div></div>
Not too sure what is in the works for more chambered calibers. That decision is for the gentlemen down the hall. I'll let ya know when I find out.
Re: Bergara barrels
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Acehigh</div><div class="ubbcode-body">quote,
" No trigger adjustment and glass bedded in wood stock"
this would seem to further complicate the effort.
JH </div></div>
I did not change the trigger because it breaks clean at around 2.5 lbs. The action is older than I am and is super smooth in every aspect. The stock is not the original that came on the gun new, but it a Winchester stock in very good condition. Glass bedding is a must for all rifles in my opinion.
Eric
Re: Bergara barrels
I'll be looking for it. I shoot .260 a lot, and am getting into .280, and the 6BR and BRX are definotely getting my attention; they are dominating our local FV200 matches. As a chambering I can nominally use with my standard boltface, they're interesting; as is the .30RAR, if Remington ever actually puts some brass out there. For a company intro of a new caliber, they would seem to have dropped the baton down a very deep well; even worse than they did with the .260.
Greg
Re: Bergara barrels
My model 70, the one discussed here, will be made into a 280AI sometime this year. I'm anxious about that.
I'm doing the 6.5x47 Lapua over the 260 in about a month give or take a little time. I will spend more time deciding on what optics to mount up then I will on the rifle build.
Re: Bergara barrels
I'll start this by saying I have no interest in Bergara/CVA. I do own(won it in a raffle) a CVA Muzzle loader and it is plenty accurate. I was watching one of the gun show on TV, the one with Jim Skowton, and they did a short piece on Bergara. The showed a very in depth tour of the new plant and tooling. And stated that they had help from one of the Shilen's, in setting up there process for making thier new barrels. It look pretty good.
I would think you could find the video on Youtube.
Re: Bergara barrels
so has ANYONE actually shot a rifle with a Bergara barrel? im looking into them and it seems like a good deal for my project especially if i dont have to send anything out to be machined.
Re: Bergara barrels
I own a bergara barrel on my T/C Encore. It shoots better than the factory barrel I got rid of. Not a bolt gun or course, but very accurate from a break action rifle. Shoots less than an inch @ 100yds. (average 5 shot groups, handloads) Not sure if this helps? Seems to be chambered well, no excessively long or off center throat, and the bore seems to collect much less copper than my old tube. I bought it because they garantee better than factory barrel accuracy at a cheaper price for the Encore barrels.
Re: Bergara barrels
I have had 4 barrels from them for a TC Encore and NONE of them fit properly , they were all bought through Cabela's and drop shipped from some outfit in Georga who wanted my frame when i returned the second barrel so they could "fit them together" , f*ck that i don't want some jack leg with a dremal tool carving on my frame to make the sh*t barrel they are pedeling fit. Three barrels would not lock up 90% of the time unless you slammed the sh*t out of it then you could pop it under the hing pin and it would fall open , one of those barrel had a pin hole that a Bellem 2x pin would fall through , the last barrel i recieved would not even close half way on the frame
The chamber in all barrels was cut poorly and had serious visible tool marks and grooves I ran a thin brass punch in it and it sounded like a zipper , the area where they welded the lug on was still disscolored so you could see where the heat traveled half way around the barrel.
The scope base holes in all 4 barrels were so far out that you could not get all 4 screws in them .
Overall I woulden't use one to as a tommato stake.
Fortunatly after an ugly phone call to Cabela's i was refunded my money and all the shipping cost which the company that drop shipped it for them refused to do stating they would swap them out till they got one to fit or modify my frame to make it fit !!!
You get what you pay for and personaly if you want a cheap barrel id at least get a US made tube from ER Shaw
Thats just my dealing with them I'd sure that their are some happy campers out their but I have barrels from Bellem , BullBerry , Virgin Vally , Fox Ridge , SSK and EA Brown and they all fit and work great and none of them need my frame or needed to "fit" the barrel any further
Re: Bergara barrels
Bergara is bit of an enigma here. I like some of the production methods they are using, is what I'd like to emulate somewhat here, but watching the video and talking to their sales staff at SHOT/IWA, they still miss the most basics of points when it comes to barrlmaking. Ed Shilen did well helping them understand, but I think they could be better than they are. They're that close, but the cigar is just out of reach. Also, I don't know whose steel they are using. If it's spanish steel it's going to walk..if it's Italian, welcome to SAko/tikkas troubles when they switched to Beretta..If it's German or French they're starting on the right foot..just my .02
Re: Bergara barrels
thanks everyone for the sound advice im definitely going to just save the money for a nicer more reliable barrel.
JR where in brevard are you located im from melbourne and if your a barrel maker maybe i should just talk to you. im looking for a full bull barrel for my remington 700 SA chambered in .308 preferably 1-10 twist and 26" long. let me know if you might be up for the project in about three months.
Re: Bergara barrels
Ballz,
well, for now I'm not doing private work, my mental and physical resources are completely spent on projects for Knight's Armament. That won't always be the case, once it tones down I plan to get the custom side myself going when time permits as central floria REALLY needs some more precision gunsmithing options to choose from.
Re: Bergara barrels
very cool i had actually never heard of knights until i moved to tampa a few months ago well good for you. let me know if you ever do take up doing work for the private sector.
Re: Bergara barrels
Just wanted to plug in about the "sales guys' at Bergara barrels. They're not the engineers or the quality control managers in any way. They sell the barrels and they're pretty good at what they do.
As far as the technical aspects of the barrels go, they DO have technical support that goes over the Basque factory's method of the actual barrel-making process. They're the ones to contact for assistance. The barrels are great. As far as bolt-actions go, the nut barrels and the blanks for gunsmiths will shoot up against any company in the US. A bergara shooter just took 3rd in Spain's F-class open finals this year.
With regards to the comments about Italian steel vs. German steel vs. "whatever" steel in Europe, the Basques produce about 80% of the best stainless and chrome-moly steel for ALL of Europe from their foundries. Bergara is 10 miles from these foundries and use that steel. The BEST stainless steel in Europe is the Basque-made steel from Bilbao and surrounding towns. Just becasue Germans and French make rifles does not mean that make the steel for them, not to mention that the French rifle region is simply the Basques on the French side. Understand the ins and outs of the industry folks.
An accurate representation Bergara was on Shooting USA October 20, 2010.
Re: Bergara barrels
what the f*ck is a Bergara Barrel?????
Re: Bergara barrels
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: A10XRIFLE</div><div class="ubbcode-body">what the f*ck is a Bergara Barrel?????</div></div>
Re: Bergara barrels
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: A10XRIFLE</div><div class="ubbcode-body">what the f*ck is a Bergara Barrel????? </div></div>
I think its one of them barrels they make wine in a box in.
Re: Bergara barrels
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: A10XRIFLE</div><div class="ubbcode-body">what the f*ck is a Bergara Barrel????? </div></div>
if the most respected smith on the forum has that to say about it, I'm not interested in the product.
Thank you and have a nice day
Re: Bergara barrels
Nice concept. I'd be in if an American company made the same style in good SS with good rifling.
Re: Bergara barrels
Ten points to the first one who calls GAP and specs a build with a bergara lol.
Re: Bergara barrels
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: A10XRIFLE</div><div class="ubbcode-body">what the f*ck is a Bergara Barrel????? </div></div>
I gather it is from this place in Spain?
Re: Bergara barrels
Id really had hever never heard of them, I just poked arround their website, nothing special just another button rifled barrel doesnt even look like they are lapping them. Not realy impressed. Of all the button rifled barrels Ive used Schneider is the only one that impresses me.
Re: Bergara barrels
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: A10XRIFLE</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Id really had hever never heard of them, I just poked arround their website, nothing special just another button rifled barrel <span style="font-weight: bold">doesnt even look like they are lapping them.</span> Not realy impressed. Of all the button rifled barrels Ive used Schneider is the only one that impresses me. </div></div>
There <span style="font-weight: bold">was</span> something in their process page that mentioned polishing the bore prior to rifling instead of lapping?
http://www.bergarabarrels.com/bergarabarrels/process.html
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">PRECISION STEP THREE – BARREL POLISHING
While most other barrel manufacturers move directly from deep hole drilling to the rifling process, all Bergara Barrels pass through three separate honing spindles. The honing spindles utilize diamond-tipped bits that polish the barrel’s interior surface to a mirror-like finish with a groove diameter deviation of less than 9/1,000 (or .009MM) of a millimeter. It’s the same result that many gunsmiths accomplish by hand-lapping a barrel.</div></div>
Re: Bergara barrels
after dealing the QC of their Encore barrels I woulden't bother even if they were half that cost.
If they can get a Lug attached properly I highly doubt that their QC manages their rifeling any better
Re: Bergara barrels
I've just been enquiring here in the UK about a new Bartlein or Tru-Flite barrel and was offered one of these Bergara barrels as an alternative. Never heard of them before today and immediately did a search here to see if they'd been mentioned.
I'm led to believe some shooters here in the UK have used them to good success but can't substantiate that at the moment.
The major draw to them is the price! They are about half the cost of the above mentioned which is substantial. Would really be interested if anyone has rebarrelled their bolt-action using one and can share the outcome.
Re: Bergara barrels
I have a tc pro hunter i recently purchased a bergara barrel in .270 the main reason was it was on sale for 200.00,28" barrel fluted stainless. I did some research and gunsmith mike bellm @bellm.com, loves them. But he makes products for them i had slop in my encore so i had to buy oversized hinge pin from mike but damn it shot great .5@100 .85@200. I had to modify it,so if i never would have talked to mike it would be POS!! That is my personal experience with bergara.
Re: Bergara barrels
I dont have any experience with them as of yet but my take on them is this, I really dont think there going to break any benchrest records in the near future, however if you look at there website they state that there guaranteed to shoot better than your standard factory barrel. Thats not too bad given how well some of today's factory guns perform. I think there probably only really a cheap option for the not too serious occasional hunter. Thats my quids worth anyway but I could be proven otherwise.
Re: Bergara barrels
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: mountaineerjdm</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Just wanted to plug in about the "sales guys' at Bergara barrels. They're not the engineers or the quality control managers in any way. They sell the barrels and they're pretty good at what they do.
As far as the technical aspects of the barrels go, they DO have technical support that goes over the Basque factory's method of the actual barrel-making process. They're the ones to contact for assistance. The barrels are great. As far as bolt-actions go, the nut barrels and the blanks for gunsmiths will shoot up against any company in the US. A bergara shooter just took 3rd in Spain's F-class open finals this year.
With regards to the comments about Italian steel vs. German steel vs. "whatever" steel in Europe, the Basques produce about 80% of the best stainless and chrome-moly steel for ALL of Europe from their foundries. Bergara is 10 miles from these foundries and use that steel. The BEST stainless steel in Europe is the Basque-made steel from Bilbao and surrounding towns. Just becasue Germans and French make rifles does not mean that make the steel for them, not to mention that the French rifle region is simply the Basques on the French side. Understand the ins and outs of the industry folks.
An accurate representation Bergara was on Shooting USA October 20, 2010. </div></div>
I reckon I have a pretty good understanding the ins and outs of European barrel steel, mate..
- May 14, 2004
- 1,150
- 4
- 68
Re: Bergara barrels
JR my friend HOW DARE you question a newbie with 7 whole posts!!! He is a 'supervisor' and you are just a well......well.......just a nice young fella that has covered more ground than most your age, but dammit yer NOT a self proclaimed 'supervisor' so deal with it!!!!!
Oh, and you might have made a barrel or two since yer nuts dropped.lol But still...................
Re: Bergara barrels
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: SDWhirlwind</div><div class="ubbcode-body">JR my friend HOW DARE you question a newbie with 7 whole posts!!! He is a 'supervisor' and you are just a well......well.......just a nice young fella that has covered more ground than most your age, but dammit yer NOT a self proclaimed 'supervisor' so deal with it!!!!!
Oh, and you might have made a barrel or two since yer nuts dropped.lol But still................... </div></div>
Well, was once a UK government proclaimed 'expert' in the field when they allowed me to work in their country, but wtf do they know. Only had a chance of 1 in however many hundreds of millions in Europe to meet the reqs. And in that time worked with a lot of steel we don't see in the good ol' USA...Got a pretty good feel which barrel steel came from where, the chip don't lie. Customers often sent blanks from their prospective regions, various mills, I know how they performed in manufacture. I know what a match grade barrel is and what it takes to make it so. The US brought me back, now I teach supervisors for a living. It's all good.
